kudos to him for being a standup guy. >> i love that. his mom taught him well. lions/vikings. got to give us a preview. thank you for joining me. "at this hour with berman and bolduan" starts now. i'm john berman. kate bolduan is off this morning. breaking news, a morning of firsts and lasts for the president-elect. the first time he taps someone other than a white male to be part of his administration. we have learned that south carolina governor nikki haley is the choice to be the first ambassador to the united nations, an up and coming leader in the republican party. on the subject of firsts, this is her first foray into international relations. other names floating this morning, reports that ben carson has been offered hud secretary. mitt romney is still a leading contender at state. and former cia chief david petraeus would take a job if offered. we are waiting for word on those

picks. however, their days end up, none will have a better day than tater or tot. they are the turkeys now in the running for presidential pardon. this will be the final turkey commutation for president obama, coming in just under four hours. i tried and failed to get a countdown clock for that. let's start with the trump transition. the president-elect is in palm beach on a working break so cnn political reporter sara murray is here with all the new details. the word this morning is nikki haley. this is a significant pick. >> it is significant. him picking nikki haley as ambassador to the united nations is an indication it wasn't just a head fake when donald trump said he would be willing to look to some of his past political rivals to serve in his cabinet. the two of them have exchanged words and they are not very pleasant. listen. >> donald trump is everything we teach our kids not to do in kindergarten. >> i will not stop until we

fight a man that chooses not to disavow the kkk. >> she's very very weak on illegal immigration. you can't have that. >> we don't want a president that will come in and bash and sit there and tell us what we are not doing right. >> when a bully hits you, you hit that bully right back. >> now it appears both of them are prepared to just let bygones be bygones as she prepares to join a trump administration. one other past critic still in the mix is the potential of mitt romney as donald trump's secretary of state. now, this is not set in stone. we know mitt romney is seriously considering it. he's talking to his advisers, to his family. we know that donald trump is seriously considering it. but there are still other names in this mix. rudy giuliani, who has been a trump loyalist and close adviser really since early in donald trump's presidential bid, has made it clear that he's interested in secretary of state. so he's still in the running for that position as well. yet another name that we may see emerging in the mix is former

cia chief david petraeus. he has indicated now that he would be willing to serve in a trump administration if he's asked. he said it's sort of a sense of duty and you have to say yes. trump has said plenty of complimentary things about petraeus on the campaign trail but this could be a sticky situation. trump also hit hillary clinton hard, saying she mishandled classified information and petraeus was in similar hot water of his own. he resigned from his station as cia chief amid an extramarital affair and really amid scandal and pled guilty to mishandling some confidential information of his own. we will see if that subplot goes anywhere. >> sara murray, thanks so much. joining us now in this discussion, kirsten power, "usa today" columnist mary katherine ham, senior writer for the federalist, basil smichel and steve cortes, former donald trump campaign adviser. sara murray will scoot up to the

table as well. m.k., i want to talk about what nikki haley is first. yes, she's the first woman, first minority brought into the donald trump inner circle. she's also, i can't tell you how many years, i guess about six right now, we have heard that nikki haley is the future of the republican party. >> yeah. i'm not sure what's on donald trump's mind when he's bringing her on. i think he's probably hiring people based on a gut feeling which is how he ran his campaign. words of advice from close friends and colleagues which is how he ran his campaign. i think she's a smart person, she's a rival of his from the past or at least a critic, and i think it's sort of encouraging from my point of view to see him want to have someone who was a strong critic and a strong person and strong intellect come on board. her job at that position will largely be based on what the secretary of state says and that policy, that relationship, we will wait to see who he puts there, but nice to see him

naming somebody who could have a spine. >> kirsten, now what she is not. at least not yet. that's a foreign policy expert. she's not seen as someone who has had vast experience in that field. yes, she's been an elected governor of south carolina. no doubt she's worked with business interests and foreign interests there, but not an expert here. >> right. i mean, that is the first thing that jumps out, that she doesn't have any real experience that would really have prepared her for this position in terms of foreign policy experience. but i think it speaks to donald trump's style which is he doesn't really value policy experience for himself as well. he tends to think -- i think he tends to focus more on sort of the interpersonal skills, somebody who can communicate well, these kind of things. i think she probably thinks she's smart and can get up to speed. i'm not sure if that's right. i think that tends to be the way he approaches things. >> this shows an openness to diversity, right? yes, there have been five white male picks but now you have nikki haley.

ben carson has been offered the hud job. there are reports of that. this shows a willingness to be open not just to diversity but also diversity of thought. diversity of opinion. diversity of experience. nikki haley is someone who has been very vocal against donald trump in the past. nikki haley is someone who comes from south carolina and might not have the same views on foreign policy as someone who has been working in think tanks for many years. >> with nikki haley specifically, her star had been on the rise for awhile and there was a lot of conversation about her, around her decision to take down the confederate flag, if you remember. >> a lot of praise. >> a lot of praise. absolutely. so she was seen as a star, is soon as a star in the republican party. but i think going to your question more specifically, what's interesting to me is two things. one, that donald trump, to me, it is about personality. it's not so much about policy but it's about his willingness to -- for folks to get along with him, first and foremost. number two, i think just the fact that you have a candidate

or president-elect who through his candidacy talked about draining the swamp but these are very familiar names to us. so i don't know if it actually follows with the things he talked about during the campaign but certainly, these choices are all about individuals who despite their former disagreements, are willing to sort of toe the line. >> if someone had said i represented everything that you teach your kids in kindergarten not to be, i might not bring them into my inner circle or even outer circle, for that. along those lines, there is another name still being discussed, sara murray just reported, as a potential secretary of state. that is mitt romney. the former massachusetts governor who was highly and personally critical of donald trump over the last 12 years. apparently still very much in the running. mitt romney talking to his family about it. donald trump talking to his family about it. now you have a lot of other people talking about it as well. namely, donald trump's supporters who say it would be a very very bad idea. mike huckabee says it would be an insult to trump's supporters

and newt gingrich really is on this campaign right now to have the pick be rudy giuliani and not mitt romney. listen to this. >> i would be concerned, one, i think the vast majority of trump's supporters will initially be very unhappy and will be reminded of all the things romney said over the year and two, because romney does represent a very different viewpoint. i can think of 20 other people who would be more naturally compatible with the trump vision of foreign policy. >> steve, long-time donald trump supporter, are you on team romney or team newt huckabee rudy here? >> i'm on team trump. i believe, listen, i ardently trust his judgment. i thought from within the campaign i saw first-hand what he cared first about was talent, regardless of skin color or orientation or background, so i think he will select the most talented people. i guess i would say to my fellow

trump supporters please have faith in our man. my guess is he's not going to pick romney but i'm not privy to those discussions so we will see. >> do you think it would be an insult to his supporters as mike huckabee said? >> i disagree, respectfully. like nikki haley, what he's showing is leadership. the core of his team is going to be comprised of loyalists like general flynn, mike pompeo. i think he will always have a core group of loyalists at the helm. what i think he's showing is strength in leadership, that he wants his cabinet to both look like america and it's wonderful he just appointed the daughter of an immigrant. the republican castigated as being this white male party. two of the candidates are -- we can't argue about that. he also appointed the daughter of an immigrant, someone who was caustic in her criticism of him.

we are seeing president-elect trump is very different from candidate trump in that once we're done, this is what democracy has to do, once we are done with a rigorous campaign, at times a bruising campaign, now we have to move on to governing this country for growth and security. >> let's see what else he does with the rest of the picks. still a lot more to come. sara, i have to tell you in the intrigue category here, as soon as i heard nikki haley this morning i thought well, maybe that means mitt romney is getting less likely. because then if you pick mitt romney as secretary of state, then you have two critics of donald trump as really a big chunk of the foreign policy team right here. you also have two people who are part of, seen as the republican establishment. that would be a lot. >> it would be a lot. but i also do think he was genuinely pleased by this meeting that he had with mitt romney. we are still told governor romney is under serious consideration. i think more so than that calculation, it's almost a calculation between governor romney and rudy giuliani.

donald trump really does prize loyalism in the people that are close to him and rudy giuliani gave him that throughout the campaign. they do feel like he has the experience necessary to do the job. but they think it could be a bloody confirmation hearing. so it's a question of do you want to spend your political capital on something like that, on such a high profile position and he also likes, this is a very donald trump thing, that mitt romney looks the part. that he looks like a statesman and just from a visual perspective, would represent him well. i think there are certainly clashes in their ideology. russia is a big example of that. but i also think folks who are coming in know that they are signing on to serve under a donald trump white house, under a donald trump ticket and they know that in a battle, ultimately donald trump's decision is the decision. >> one thing i would raise, though, to that point is efficacy. how effective would a mitt romney be around the world? what i think about is the secretary of state is not just about the position not just about keeping the peace but also about promoting american values

across the globe. so if you are mitt romney and you have called your boss, if you are secretary of state, you called your boss a mysogenist, how do you go across the globe and talk about women's rights? how do you do that effectively? >> i think if we learned one thing in this "new york times" sit-down yesterday, it's that donald trump may not be rigid on a lot of things, right? he said on climate change he may listen to all views. all of a sudden on waterboarding, general mattis changed his mind there. on infrastructure, maybe, maybe not. it may be that there's not much actually written in stone here. >> right. he's not an idealogical creature. he made promises on the campaign trail and to some extent will answer for those. to some extent i think his supporters say he's the guy at the table, the guy i want at the table and the guy i want making the decisions. when it comes to romney going around the world, i think actually, he would be pretty effective because in that position you are supposed to be the diplomatic guy. yes, he went after trump but he's far closer to a diplomat than the average sort of trump

loyalist style would be when it comes to that kind of thing. so i think perhaps that's what he's thinking. but he's a guy who is unpredictable, who is not idealogical, who doesn't have a record in government, and he makes these decisions i think a bit on the fly as he's having to throughout transition, and can be swayed often by a close associate who has a different opinion, as you saw with mattis on the waterboarding issue. >> kirsten, based on what we have seen with these picks and based on what you saw with that hour-long sit down with the "new york times," what do you make of that? what do you make of donald trump's convictions now, weeks after the election? >> well, i don't think -- what mary katherine just said, but i'm not that surprised because i always thought this about him and the few times i interviewed him, it came through very clearly that he's not -- he's just not an idealogue. he really likes to make deals which is not a surprise to anybody. he's somebody who is a deal maker and is more sort of practical, i think, and really doesn't seem to hold grudges. when i had interviewed him it was towards the end of the primary and i asked him would he consider any of his opponents as

potential vice president picks and even at that point he said yeah. he had kind of moved on. it wasn't -- people who he had been attacking so vigorously, now that he had defeated them or it looked like he had defeated them, he was a lot more gracious. i'm not surprised by this. i think the one thing that's concerning is we do have to wonder, i don't know which is his actual position. he can be so flexible on things like climate change, for example, how do we -- i don't really know what his actual position is. i think on a lot of issues, i think we have to wait and see. >> it's possible he don't have one or it moves, one thing one day, the other the next. do any of you have a position on tater or tot? as the turkey who will be pardoned? anyone want to weigh in? everyone is for all the turkeys. thanks to you all so much for being with us. have a happy thanksgiving. >> you, too. computer scientists pleading with hillary clinton to

challenge the election results in three key states. find out why and find out if the clinton campaign is listening. plus, he's one of the people credited with winning the trump or winning the election for trump. so how is his son-in-law explaining all of this and why is all of a sudden talking after bragging about not talking? heartbreaking new details on the bus crash that killed at least five children. parents, friends, families speaking out about their loss. >> it's so close to the holidays. it won't be the same for a lot of parents and families and stuff. this is very, very hard. and it hurts, because these are innocent babies. downer. ed to be a real especially around the holidays. but thanks to fingerhut.com, we can shop over 700,000 items from brands like samsung, kitchenaid and lego. all with low monthly payments. ♪

this morning tennessee governor bill haslam visited woodmore elementary school in chattanooga to offer condolences to the community mourning the horrific bus crash. of the five children confirmed dead, three were fourth graders, one a first grader and one was in kindergarten. 12 children still in critical care right now. nick valencia is following that story. what are you learning? >> reporter: john, it goes without saying it's not what

these families expected this holiday week. it's not how they expected to spend thanksgiving holiday. numerous amount of family members here in chattanooga are going to be mourning the loss of their young children, ages kindergarten to fifth grade. this accident on monday really striking a chord emotionally here in this city, obviously. 12 of them remain hospitalized, six of them in stable condition, six in critical condition. earlier i spoke with bishop kevyn adams, who the community really has turned to for encouragement, for comepassion and support in this time of grief. he said, he described to me the situation inside the hospital as some of these parents learned that their children had died. >> something i have never, never experienced before as the doctors were coming in and you know, just announced to a family that your child is deceased. i saw mothers literally passing out, people all on the floor,

the screams, i can still hear them. i woke up this morning with some chilling sounds, you could just hear the screams. they didn't know what to do. they was grabbing, holding on to myself and other chaplains and ministers, asking is my child really gone, are they coming back. you don't know what to do with that. but just lay on the floor with them, cry, hold on to them and you know, it makes you reflect on what's important in life and how much we take for granted. >> reporter: you could hear just how difficult it was for bishop adams to talk about this. it's hard to imagine what it was like to witness. the suspect in this accident, johnthony walker, remains in custody charged with five kids of vehicular homicide. we have also looked into his driving history. we know he's been a bus driver with the school district since april. it was just in september that he was involved in another accident, single car accident,

sideswiping a vehicle. no injuries in that accident. but investigators are no doubt going to be looking into his history. we are waiting hopefully some toxicology tests. we're not sure if those have been done. we are hoping to get more information about this suspect, an individual, all of this will be part of the investigation. >> such a difficult time in chattanooga. nick, thanks so much. so conflicts of interest, no way suggests donald trump. he's going to be the president and the law protects him, he says. we will discuss that coming up. plus, a group of scientists is asking hillary clinton to challenge the election result in three states. we will tell you how the clinton campaign responded. (pop) campbell's tomato soup and grilled cheese. (more popping) go together like being late and being grounded. made for real, real life.™ won't replace the full value of your totaled new car. the guy says you picked the wrong insurance plan.

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new developments this morning in the shaping of the new democratic party, including the debate over whether it should really be new at all. serious jostling behind the scenes to determine who will be the next party chair, a battle that as of this morning pits the west wing against the left wing. that description from the pen of my next guest, jonathan martin, national political correspondent for the "new york times." thank you for being with us. the left wing as you say wants keith ellison. congressman from minnesota, to be the next party chair. bernie sanders supports him. elizabeth warren supports him. jack schumer even supports him. but the west wing and the people who work for president obama, they are not so sure. why? >> well, because a couple reasons. the first one is there is a consensus in the white house but also even beyond that among most democrats that this should be a full-time job.

there's a sort of sense of regret after debbie wasserman schultz's tenure who was simultaneously serving in congress and chairing the dnc that it just didn't work, that you have to have somebody doing the job in a full-time capacity, especially when you don't control the white house. that chairman of the party is really the face or a key face at least of the opposition. so that's the overriding issue. this should be a full-time post. beyond that, there are concerns about ellison's politics. he's definitely on the sort of far liberal side in the house. i think there are some concerns over some of his past comments about the nation of islam, leader louis farrakhan. he recanted the comments but those kind of things have raised eyebrows in democratic circles. this is a really important debate because given the democrats are out of power in the house, the senate, most governorships, the chairmanship of the dnc is really going to be an important voice in rebuilding

the democratic party and in really fighting back against president-elect trump. >> you have a sense of how much sway the president's team will have in this? >> yeah, look, president obama is extraordinarily popular in the democratic grassroots. i think the folks who are voting on this are largely people in the states. it's state democratic chairmen and vice chairmen and people on the committees who come from those states. they very much like president obama. but this is kind of a heart versus a head issue. any time a president is leaving office, there is even in the minds of a lot of activists, a desire for kind of new blood and also to sort of take the reins of the party. any time also a party doesn't control the white house, the people on the party committee like to make the choice for themselves. they don't so much like having this imposed on them from folks in washington. i think it's going to be a really fascinating question. you will see democratic activists wrestling with president obama's preference, somebody they like and really in

some ways love, but at the same time, looking for a new face, looking for fresh blood and recognizing that the last eight years haven't been great for their party writ large. >> let me ask you for your take on a couple developments quickly. number one, overnight people who are doing the counting, our friends watching this very closely, say hillary clinton's lead in the popular vote is now over two million. you and i both know this gets her nothing and that's not how campaigns are run and won in the united states. still, two million is a pretty significant margin. >> yeah. it's going to be the widest popular vote margin for a loser going back over a century and a half. it makes this even tougher for democrats. it makes the question of rebuilding even more complicated, because they are now grappling with well, how big is the problem, how significant are our challenges, was this just a matter of 100,000 votes

in three states or are our problems more structural and more serious. i think that is going to sort of frame this debate that we are talking about for the next chairman of the party. just real fast, i should add a big issue sort of looming is this proxy war between the bernie sanders forces and the more obama/clinton mainline democratic forces. sanders loves keith ellison, very close to him, and bernie came out very early after ellison got in, even before he got in, to encourage him to run. keep an eye on that dynamic, too. >> quickly, you mentioned 100,000 votes in three states. there are computer scientists saying you should recount in michigan, wisconsin and pennsylvania because the computer ballots are different than the paper ballots. they did a conference call and got senior clinton campaign people to listen but this doesn't feel like it's going anywhere, does it? >> if the clinton folks were interested in that, i think we would have heard by now. time is of the essence when it comes to these challenges, these recounts. the fact they are not pushing it

i think sort of tells you the story. but this is tough for democrats. the line i have heard over and over again is that you can put the margin that hillary lost the presidency by in three states, in michigan stadium and still have extra room. it's that close of a deficit. pennsylvania, michigan and wisconsin. but those are the rules of the game and she was aware of that. and the fact is that she scrambled in michigan too late and they didn't see wisconsin coming. >> if you are going to fill the michigan stadium you have to campaign there, maybe, a little more. jonathan martin, great to have you with us. thanks so much. >> thanks, john. donald trump says he doesn't want a quote, reset with russia. russia says it is fine with that. the kremlin cites hillary clinton for not caring for the, our word, saying it would be hard to make u.s./russia relations any worse. what's going on? plus, all eyes on the white

house. if only we could get a countdown clock for this. we have had them for other things, why not this? in about three hours, the president will make a decision, will it be tater, will it be tot? who will receive the final presidential turkey pardon from president obama? stay with us. s managing my moderate to severe crohn's disease. i didn't think there was anything else to talk about. but then i realized there was. so, i finally broke the silence with my doctor about what i was experiencing. he said humira is for people like me who have tried other medications but still experience the symptoms of moderate to severe crohn's disease. in clinical studies, the majority of patients on humira saw significant symptom relief. and many achieved remission. humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. before treatment, get tested for tb. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common,

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i won this 55 inch tv for less than $30 on dealdash.com. visit dealdash.com for great deals. and start bidding today! the breaking news this morning, word that president-elect donald trump has selected nikki haley. he will nominate nikki haley to be his ambassador to the united nations. she's the popular governor of south carolina. this is the first woman or minority that donald trump has decided to bring in to his inner circle. while that's going on, donald trump sat down with the "new york times" yesterday for an hour and talked about a wide range of issues, talked about

his positions on a wide range of issues. for reaction to all this, want to bring in ceo of the heritage foundation's political arm, heritage action, michael needham joins us. if you read the articles, the heritage foundation right now is key in helping donald trump through this transition process. so we assume you are big on making all the decisions or made them all yourself. what do you make of this decision? >> donald trump is making the decisions. we are trying to help him and offer our expertise as desired. nikki haley has been a phenomenal governor, she created jobs, did ethics reform, she's bright, a quick learner, she will be a fantastic representative. >> do you need foreign policy experience to be ambassador to dwrunt the united nations? >> she went overseas over a dozen times but she's also been an incredible governor. >> would you say foreign policy is her main area of expertise? >> running an administration has been her main area of expertise in south carolina and now as the president's representative at the united nations she will be involved in the exact same types of skills she has been using running a state, interacting

with people and representing interests. >> we were talking during the break about donald trump's interview with the "new york times" yesterday, the hour-long sitdown. you suggested it shows that he will stand up for the conservative principles that are so important to heritage. the flipside of that, a lot of people are reading this thing and noticing that in this sit-down with the "new york times" he seemed to be open to at least not -- seemed to be open to the idea that climate change, the paris accord would stick, seemed to be open to the idea he would not waterboard, seemed to be open to the idea of maybe not doing infrastructure spending he said before. it's hard to know where he is on the positions. >> i read the actual transcript of this thing. if you lo ok at what he says on climate change, it's what we would have said at heritage. there are questions that need to be looked at, there's research on both sides of the issue. this is not settled science the way some people on the left want to say. once you figure out what exactly is going on with climate change we need to have a conversation about what is man's role in it. most importantly, what is the public policy response and does it cause more harm --

>> do you anticipate he will withdraw from the paris accords? >> he should. >> will you be disappointed if he doesn't? >> sure. i think when he looks at it as he says in the interview, he will look at the merits, listen to a lot of people and you will find the damage done to the economy by the paris accords does not in any way -- >> do you think donald trump, the president-elect, has conservative convictions? >> i do. i think that especially reading that interview with the "new york times," you see and i don't know where his convictions were ten years ago or five years ago. i think certainly over the course of this campaign, the experience of going around the country has made him more conservative in virtually every single answer in that "new york times" interview yesterday, i thought that his initial answer was something that shows a kind of deep understanding of conservative instincts. >> is it conservative to not separate your business interests from the business of government? >> i think it's kind of a cheap shot on donald trump. this is the first businessman who has ever been in there. he has an incredibly complicated business and it's a difficult business to sell off. as he said to the "new york times" this is not just some stock that he can go out there

and sell. i think that what he's trying to do, it seems, is figure out what is the right way to take a complicated business, to kind of distance himself in a realistic way. it's just not realistic to sell. >> does heritage think he should create distance between his private business and the business of government? >> i don't think we have a position on that. d.c. is important. washington, >> cronyism count for having your business profit while president? >> i think he's trying to figure out, is he trying to figure out the right way to do this. it seems to me he is. as we go forward, if this becomes a kind of cronyist administration, we are not going to be hesitant to criticize that. i think realistically if anybody has suggestions as to what he should be doing, that are kind of realistic to his circumstances, i would expect him to take them up. if he doesn't, they have a real issue. i'm not sure what he could be doing, not sure what his critics are asking him to do that he's not currently doing. >> michael needham, great to have you back. come on back. interesting discussion. we are talking about someone else now, he's young, rich,

handsome, successful and normally quiet. we are talking about the son-in-law of donald trump, who is credited by many with helping him win this campaign. now jared kushner, who says he doesn't talk, is talking. hear what he has said about the campaign, everything from chris christie to mcdonald's. plus, i won. i have a countdown clock right now. you can see it there on the bottom of the screen. three hours and two minutes until president obama's final turkey pardon. which turkey will he choose? will it be tater, will it be tot? three hours and two minutes until the turkey learns its fate. stay with us. your insurance company

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this morning, russia says it is hoping for better relations with the united states. the kremlin spokesman says

quote, relations are at the bottom so it's hard to make them worse. he says he hopes the relationship moves back to a constructive course. want to bring in cnn's chief international correspondent christiane amanpour. what does russia want over the next four years? >> i think it means from russia's perspective it wants the united states and therefore, the west, to accept its terms. so it wants the west to ignore the amnexation of crimea, the invasion of eastern ukraine, the harassment of nato members like the baltic states very close to russia and it probably drew a lot of comfort from when newt gingrich called the capital of astonia. so russia is looking for a more sympathetic ear from the united states and to not hold russia to, you know, what all international law is, basically international law is about big countries not invading smaller

countries, right? russia annexed crimea. it wants that knocked off the books and the spokesman you just quoted said that to me, hoping a new administration would ignore those kinds of things and move forward. russia also wants to see this war in syria end but on its terms. so end the war by allowing assad to have at least aleppo and at least damascus and a rump state or a bit more it can control to what they believe assad is the sort of bulwark against terrorism. donald trump in his interview with the united states -- sorry, with the "new york times," has said actually, assad is going after the terrorist, russia and iran is going after the terrorists, we must go after the terrorists. that will be very interesting to see with a trump administration, does it let syria go or does it try to do something that will

assuage the hundreds of thousands of people who have been killed already. >> sounds like russia is saying we will have a better relationship as long as you do it our way. >> sort of. people are care phful about a tp vacation making a grand bargain. >> donald trump went off the record when talking about syria so we don't know exactly what was said, if perhaps the obama administration or president obama had told him something about syria that he didn't want to go on the record there. on that subject, apparently the obama administration, obama team, has told the trump team that north korea, you know, is right now and should be one of the major areas of concern which to me sounds like welcome to the fate of the last several presidents. >> yes, but it's even worse now. i think that's absolutely correct. north korea will be a major challenge to the next administration. we haven't really been paying attention to north korea. let's face it, neither the administration nor the press has really been paying attention because it's so intractable and they have had syria and all the russian, iran, and all the rest of it. what james clapper, outgoing

director of national intelligence, said was that trying to get north korea to renounce its nuclear weapons, remember, it is a weapon state, not just a program, it has devices that it's tested, trying to get north korea to renounce those, he said, clapper, try to get north korea to cap its nuclear weapons capability. something really interesting to watch and to see if a new administration does have a different approach than obama, who was sort of strategic patience did not want to directly engage the united states with north korea, relied heavily on china. you know, it's only paid certain dividends. a whole new intensive set of trying to figure out that will be required, and it's very tough. very tough. >> increasing enigma north korea faces with another administration. christiane amanpour, thank you for coming in. and speaking out, a rare

interview. donald trump may rely on his son noll pave the way for mideast peace. a jared kushner up to that task? plus, any moment now, in fact, in 2 hours, 5 had minutes, the world will learn the fate of tater and tot. which turkey will president obama pardon? the big convenient. we're on it. stay tuned.

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generosity is its oyou can handle being a mom for half an hour. i'm in all the way. is that understood?

i don't know what she's up to, but it's not good. can't the world be my noodles and butter? get your mind out of the gutter. mornings are for coffee and contemplation. that was a really profound observation. you got a mean case of the detox blues. don't start a war you know you're going to lose. finally you can now find all of netflix in the same place as all your other entertainment. on xfinity x1. the donald trump transition. dr. ben carson, an announcement is coming forthright in what my role will be. he was offered the job of hud secretary, howison and urgen development and think he wouldn't be tweeting about helping make american great

again unless he was going to accept that offer. apparently an announcement is forthcoming on that. stay tuned. besides ben carson, the most intriguing figure of the 2016 campaign who doesn't give interviews just gave an interview. how much does donald trump count on his son jared kushner? so hedge much oh might rely on 38-year-old to rely on mideast peace. jared kushner spoke extensively to editor stephen bertoni who joins us now. >> thanks for having me. >> jared kushner said he didn't give interviews. so why is he giving one? >> even before the chris christie stuff, "es quichoi"esq "vant fair," decided to speak with us. >> he said the chris christie wasn't him. what was him, bringing in all

kinds of new high-tech campaign practices to this. what did he do? >> he start frtd scratch. he's a real estate mogul with a lot of tech investment and wasn't an expert. how can i win an election? donald trump is a unique non-traditional candidate. how do we build a non-traditional campaign to make this work? like an entrepreneur asked a lot of confess knop assumptions. they did things. moved fast, broke things, made a lot of mistakes but then whatever would work they'll scale. treated it like a consumer start-up and that delivered, helped deliver trump the rouwhi house. wouldn't work with anyone else. trump, so twitter focused, so outside the middle bounds. >> like the moneyball of politics, people that don't know on-base -- >> went to the electoral college. every electoral college vote is worth the same amount of money, buy them, so to speak, at different levels.

said, new hampshire very intense ish, what it take for that vote. get things cheaper, maybe pennsylvania, michigan. looked at it as a vote a commodity and how to get a vote at the cheapest price. >> hillary clinton's popular vote lead moves to 2 million. >> like football. a lot of times a team loses gets more yards, but it's the team with the points. he went with the points. >> pate tritt knriots know exac that means. talk to me about the relationship between these two men? how much does donald trump rely on jared kushner and exactly why? >> jared is -- everything, talk about, very quiet, eastern keeled. has an open mind. henry kissinger, peter thiel and eric schmidt, other side of the fence. helped hillary clinton build her machine. no matter the politics you want trump to have jared in his ear. he's trusted, ration naturalera.

a lot of fear about this administration. it you're scared you want jared kushner in there. he's rational, centrist and might balance out the administration. >> donald trump said he might rely on jared kushner ho temperature reach mideast peace. when he said that, sounds like an enormous task, but surprising to you that trump said that? >> yes. this has been a problem for so many years. so complex. i don't think any one person can do that, especially he has no international experience. take that fresh look, jared helped him win the campaign, maybe that mind-set it help in middle east peace. i don't think one person it solve this. this has been the past 100 years. >> if nothing else, how much donald trump counts on jared kushner and trusts him. a great article and only one of its kind. jared kushner has never spoken like that before. thanks for being with us. >> thanks so much. put the countdown clock on

the screen. president obama will pardon either tater or tot. i i don't know which is which, but the president does. he'll make that selection. thanks for watching at this hour. "newsroom" with pamela brown starts right now. hello. welcome to "cnn newsroom." i'm pamela brown if nn for bria keilar. the holiday will probably not be entirely stress-free for donald trump and his closest aides. one more high announced, a any discussion, south carolina governor nikki haley trump wants to represent the u.s. at the u.n. trump says haley has a proorch record of bringing people together to move policies forward. haley says she's honored to join trump's team, and she might not be the only one. ben carson just dropped a pretty big hint about a big new job